Parallels to Brad Scott's coaching staff?

[McCock]

Brad Scott bad? I am sorry guys but that is just going a bit to far for me lol

I started the thread and I agree with you... didn't mean to imply that if I did. Top to bottom, I think this is probably the strongest staff we have ever had when you take into account all phases of coaching (i.e., to include evals and recruiting), or at very least 1a to the staff we had during Spurrier's four-year run after Ellis Johnson came onboard as DC. 

I see problems with our performances at times that don't seem to be wholly explainable by on-field talent and experience. I was sort of wondering aloud what role the staff's experience, specifically at the coordinator level, might play in that. A number of folks in this thread pointed out that someone like Muschamp would have had to rely on promotions to put together a staff because of who he was and how he was perceived in the profession after "failing" at UF. I think this is true, but are we suffering some now because we opted to promote from position coach to coordinator rather than promoting an experienced coordinator or coordinators from smaller schools who had already learned a lot from trial and error? No way to know the answer, I guess, but I appreciate everyone's thoughts nonetheless. 

 

[Pitchcock]

Bentley's progression disagrees

Jake’s lack of progression has nothing to do with Muschamp. And it has nothing to do with the two OC’s we’ve had. If you go back and look closely at plays called by Roper and/or McClendon, there have been a lot of good plays called that the QB simply didn’t execute on. 

Looking back on it, as a true Freshman the plays given to Jake to run didn’t call for multiple reads. They called the play, he ran it, and in most cases they seemed like designed plays going to a particular player. He did great at that.

His issues started when the fan base and the media started hyping him as a NFL player after his first year. With that hype came responsibility and the pressure to perform at a higher level. At that point is where he started crumbling. He seems to struggle with decision making....it’s why, for example, with the RPO Muschamp has stated repeatedly that the wrong decisions were being made. When you start adding in inexplicable drops by receivers and guys struggling to get open, it increased the pressure on him to try and make something happen. 

By all accounts he’s been a model spokesperson for the program. Good kid,  well spoken, stays out of trouble, very good “face of the program”.  Despite his struggles he was still in position to break a lot of our career QB records.

He simply didn’t have anyone pushing him who was as good or better until RH arrived on campus. IIRC Ryan’s first 10 passes went to 8 different receivers...Jake simply doesn’t have the decision making skills to do that. 

Again, granted, it was CSU....but we haven’t had that kind of decision making here since Shaw left. Watching RH against lesser competition compared to watching Jake against lesser competition was like the difference between night and day. Jake certainly had his moments over the previous three seasons where he was able to rise to the occasion, but he had more than his fair share of WTF moments where he clearly was mentally overmatched.

His struggles have had nothing to do with Muschamp being the HBC. He simply doesn’t have the “it factor” we all thought he’d have after his first year.

 

[Pitchcock]

I started the thread and I agree with you... didn't mean to imply that if I did. Top to bottom, I think this is probably the strongest staff we have ever had when you take into account all phases of coaching (i.e., to include evals and recruiting), or at very least 1a to the staff we had during Spurrier's four-year run after Ellis Johnson came onboard as DC. 

I see problems with our performances at times that don't seem to be wholly explainable by on-field talent and experience. I was sort of wondering aloud what role the staff's experience, specifically at the coordinator level, might play in that. A number of folks in this thread pointed out that someone like Muschamp would have had to rely on promotions to put together a staff because of who he was and how he was perceived in the profession after "failing" at UF. I think this is true, but are we suffering some now because we opted to promote from position coach to coordinator rather than promoting an experienced coordinator or coordinators from smaller schools who had already learned a lot from trial and error? No way to know the answer, I guess, but I appreciate everyone's thoughts nonetheless. 

Looking back at that staff under Spurrier, two guys in particular stood out as evaluators/recruiters....Beamer and Jay Graham. Once they were gone the problems started, taking a few years to build up to the disaster we were finally left with.

I think top to bottom our staff is head and shoulders above Sr’s 4 year run. Can it be improved? Most certainly. I wouldn’t be surprised maybe after this year to see someone like a DJ Durkin come on board.

I’d say there’s no guarantee of success when a program brings on an experienced Coordinator or promotes from a smaller program. There’s always risk....Tennessee has experienced coaches, the fan base is already turning on Pruitt. Harbaugh is embarrrassing himself at Michigan. FSU is losing patience with Taggert. 

IMHO our coaches and Coordinators are solid. Not spectacular, but solid. They work hard, and are literally looking under every rock trying to find underrated guys. A program like Clemson didn’t rise to the top immediately...they were able to sign a couple highly rated guys here and there, which allowed them to leverage success to get highly rated guys at other positions. And they evaluated well, taking a walk on like Renfrow, winning a Natty with the ball in his hands delivered by a very good QB.

Looks like we’re building similarly, we just have to get a literal handful of star players to boost us up. Those 11 win seasons we had could be attributed in large part to a solid team playing with three spectacular players....you take away Shaw, Marcus and Clowney we never win those 11 games, and Spurrier retires earlier.

 

[Sporkgod50]

Jake’s lack of progression has nothing to do with Muschamp. And it has nothing to do with the two OC’s we’ve had. If you go back and look closely at plays called by Roper and/or McClendon, there have been a lot of good plays called that the QB simply didn’t execute on. 

Looking back on it, as a true Freshman the plays given to Jake to run didn’t call for multiple reads. They called the play, he ran it, and in most cases they seemed like designed plays going to a particular player. He did great at that.

His issues started when the fan base and the media started hyping him as a NFL player after his first year. With that hype came responsibility and the pressure to perform at a higher level. At that point is where he started crumbling. He seems to struggle with decision making....it’s why, for example, with the RPO Muschamp has stated repeatedly that the wrong decisions were being made. When you start adding in inexplicable drops by receivers and guys struggling to get open, it increased the pressure on him to try and make something happen. 

By all accounts he’s been a model spokesperson for the program. Good kid,  well spoken, stays out of trouble, very good “face of the program”.  Despite his struggles he was still in position to break a lot of our career QB records.

He simply didn’t have anyone pushing him who was as good or better until RH arrived on campus. IIRC Ryan’s first 10 passes went to 8 different receivers...Jake simply doesn’t have the decision making skills to do that. 

Again, granted, it was CSU....but we haven’t had that kind of decision making here since Shaw left. Watching RH against lesser competition compared to watching Jake against lesser competition was like the difference between night and day. Jake certainly had his moments over the previous three seasons where he was able to rise to the occasion, but he had more than his fair share of WTF moments where he clearly was mentally overmatched.

His struggles have had nothing to do with Muschamp being the HBC. He simply doesn’t have the “it factor” we all thought he’d have after his first year.

with respect you are confusing your opinions with facts, beginning with your first sentence. I disagree with your opinion that it's not Muschamp but his assistants who are to blame. He's the common thread from underperforming qbs. Even if we place all the blame on his OC shuffle, he's the one that hired the first OC that desperately need replaced. Either the buck stops at the top or you're not a good leader.

Personally, I never thought Jake was going to be the next best thing since sliced bread because he never performed well in big games and often just scraped by (LA Tech) with him against bad teams. I do agree with you that Jakes problems are primarily between his ears, but for a QB that is huge part of the game. I am sure he is a nice guy though or as you say a model spokesperson for the program.

I hope that RH is good enough to succeed under champ, but until I see it against a real team...

 

[Hoganman1]

I don't know why I go on these sites. I've been a Gamecock fan for over 60 years. We've had good years and not so good years. Obviously, the Spurrier era spoiled us. Three straight 11-3 seasons was fun. Now we're rebuilding and almost everybody is blaming the coaches and Jake Bentley. I think the bottom line is UNC beat us because they blocked and tackled and we didn't. It was basic football. Maybe that is coaching, or maybe not. Let's see how things go on Saturday.  Of course I'm not expecting a win, but hey: it's college football and anything can happen. Over and Out!

 

[Sporkgod50]

I don't know why I go on these sites. I've been a Gamecock fan for over 60 years. We've had good years and not so good years. Obviously, the Spurrier era spoiled us. Three straight 11-3 seasons was fun. Now we're rebuilding and almost everybody is blaming the coaches and Jake Bentley. I think the bottom line is UNC beat us because they blocked and tackled and we didn't. It was basic football. Maybe that is coaching, or maybe not. Let's see how things go on Saturday.  Of course I'm not expecting a win, but hey: it's college football and anything can happen. Over and Out!

You might be right. Year four shouldn't be a rebuild though

 

[$Billz]

You're kidding about giving him 6 years before considering firing him, right? You do that and recruiting is going to suffer no matter how many practices we cancel for champ to go out and acquire talent.  When it's all over, the next coach will start with nothing and we'll be in the same boat sos left us with

  Got to disagree my man. CWM has done a good job with what he had to work with. The shelves were as bare for talent as we have ever had in history. This is the first year where CWM has some of HIS players in the fold that actually know what the hell they are doing on the field.  You cant put RS Freshmen and true freshmen all over the field and expect to win big.

  Coach Tanner knows better than anyone what it takes to build a championship program. I will rely on Coach Tanner to make the call on CWM but I would bet the house it is a 6 year plan.

 

[$Billz]

Thanks for this realistic view.  Muschamp is not going anywhere anytime soon.

If the offense isn't working out after this year, McLendon will (and should) get fired.

If the new OC (and the team) doesn't show significant improvement the year after that, then we will buy Muschamp out and move on after 6 years.

Hell, you need to add seeing the defense improve. I know we will see some improvement this year but next year should show us more. 

 

[$Billz]

 I would also like to add that I understand how we all feel right now. The unc game was a bad and embarrassing loss. Should not have ever happened. Bad game plan and bad coaching in my book. I don't want to see that kind of crap again or I will jump off the CWM bandwagon. 

 

[Sporkgod50]

  Got to disagree my man. CWM has done a good job with what he had to work with. The shelves were as bare for talent as we have ever had in history. This is the first year where CWM has some of HIS players in the fold that actually know what the hell they are doing on the field.  You cant put RS Freshmen and true freshmen all over the field and expect to win big.

  Coach Tanner knows better than anyone what it takes to build a championship program. I will rely on Coach Tanner to make the call on CWM but I would bet the house it is a 6 year plan.

i respect your disagreement and last year I would have agreed with you, but year four means most of Spurrier's recruits have been replaced with CWM's players. This year (or if you want to be very generous next year) is the year that blaming spurrier officially loses it's validity. 

 

[Longhaul]

i respect your disagreement and last year I would have agreed with you, but year four means most of Spurrier's recruits have been replaced with CWM's players. This year (or if you want to be very generous next year) is the year that blaming spurrier officially loses it's validity. 

I hear what you are saying, but to just look at the players in 4 years is not the whole picture.  It takes time to build relationships with schools that previously were let go by the way side.  You con't just hit a switch and the recruiting is right where you want it to be.  Most lineman if they pan out do not play until year 2 and even then most don't become a force until years 3 & 4.  Given you logic, they would have to hit on every recruit that the get to sign and not miss any and they would all need to stay healthy.  If we start making decisions on coaches based on a 4 year window you might as well plan to stay below .500 for most seasons.  This season will tell us some things, but I do believe next season will show us more of what direction we are heading.  

 

[Sporkgod50]

I hear what you are saying, but to just look at the players in 4 years is not the whole picture.  It takes time to build relationships with schools that previously were let go by the way side.  You con't just hit a switch and the recruiting is right where you want it to be.  Most lineman if they pan out do not play until year 2 and even then most don't become a force until years 3 & 4.  Given you logic, they would have to hit on every recruit that the get to sign and not miss any and they would all need to stay healthy.  If we start making decisions on coaches based on a 4 year window you might as well plan to stay below .500 for most seasons.  This season will tell us some things, but I do believe next season will show us more of what direction we are heading.  

Those are some ballots point especially regarding linemen, but cwm is no stranger to recruiting in the region so he should have relationships. Also I'd say if you fire a coach every four years you can get in a five hundred slump, but if you're not considering firing a coach until year five or six, you've set the next hire up for to really struggle. Recruiting is going to drop off  if we don't go bowling.

 

[AikenGameFan]

Recruiting is going to drop off  if we don't go bowling.

Recruiting had already dropped off when Champ got here. I think he needed a couple years just to try and get that back on track and we are finally seeing that with the Soph. and Fresman we got starting now. I say year 6 should be the true exclamation. By then he had the recruiting going right again and had some experienced players. If we are not competing for the SEC east by that year, he did not do a good job. I feel we will be in the running next year.

 

[Sporkgod50]

Recruiting had already dropped off when Champ got here. I think he needed a couple years just to try and get that back on track and we are finally seeing that with the Soph. and Fresman we got starting now. I say year 6 should be the true exclamation. By then he had the recruiting going right again and had some experienced players. If we are not competing for the SEC east by that year, he did not do a good job. I feel we will be in the running next year.

I think you misunderstood my post. I meant to give champ credit for getting recruiting going again, but I'm saying if he doesn't start winning it's going to drop back to when spurrier knew he didn't care enough and got convinced to keep going.