Frank Is Gone

[Gary]

According to Phil Kornblut, Frank will not be the USC coach next season.  His sources tell him Frank will be given several options, but none of them include remaining as coach.

 

[Gary]

According to Phil Kornblut, Frank will not be the USC coach next season.  His sources tell him Frank will be given several options, but none of them include remaining as coach.

If Frank is replaced, there should be a lot of changes in the roster for next season.   It will be on the new coach to convince some of the guys to stay, if he can.

 

[kingofnerf]

Korntater.

I will only believe it when it actually happens.

 

[Gary]

For a coach to win enough to keep his job, he has to recruit players who can play basketball well enough to win.  What kind of offense or defense a team uses only matters if the players can execute them.   There are no tricks a coach can employ that will overcome his player's lack of ability.  You either recruit guys who can make shots, or you recruit guys who can't.   Either recruit guys who can defend, or guys who can't.   Guys who can rebound, or guys who get beat for rebounds either because they are too small, or can't get in position to get the rebounds.   So, it really boils down to recruiting.  Frank has recruited some good players since he has been at USC.   Sadly, he has not been able to recruit enough of them.   And that is why he is being replaced.  It has nothing to do with his offenses or his defenses.  It has to do with the fact that he recruited guys who can't make shots, can't defend, and can't rebound and pass.

Frank tried to recruit Matt Cross who went to Miami.  I watched him play in some games.  The kid can shoot.  The kid can pass.   He's an average defender and rebounder.   But he went to Miami instead of USC.   If we had had him this season, he might have made enough shots to have enabled Frank to keep his job.  But he played for Miami, not USC.  Frank has tried to recruit several players that went elsewhere.   Had some of those guys chosen USC, we might be in the NCAAT this season instead of changing coaches. 

 

[kingofnerf]

If it happens, this will look to many outside of our fan base like we fired a Final Four coach who was physically unable to coach most of the year due to Covid.  There's no way in hell we won't get a lot of bad press out of this if it really happens.  I don't see how we can preach that student-athlete BS and have it not apply to coaches as well.

The NCAA punishment WILL affect our recruiting for the next two years.  There's a part of me that says we give him one more year to clean up his mess.

 

[GregoryHouse]

How can we get the AAU coaches and adivsors to play nice with USC?

 

[FurmanCock]

How can we get the AAU coaches and adivsors to play nice with USC?

Based on my cynical view of AAU coach's and advisors, I would expect there would need to be some kind of monetary exchange...

 

[GregoryHouse]

Based on my cynical view of AAU coach's and advisors, I would expect there would need to be some kind of monetary exchange...

They are having a significant effect on recruiting players against the university. This is not the total issue but huge.

 

[FurmanCock]

Yes they do, and I'm not sure what SC did to get on their bad side.  But in my mind, much of the corruption in the sport can be laid at the feet of the AAU and apparel contracts.  It certainly didn't start there, coaches and schools have been cheating to win for probably as long as sports have been competitive, but the pervasiveness and "normalcy" of it seems to at least correlate with the growth and influence of traveling teams and sneaker clubs.

 

[Gary]

I agree with most of this, but Minaya shot well as a Freshman, as did Couisnard. Shooting slumps happen, and are not due to bad recruiting.

If Minaya and Couisnard were healthy all year and made, say, 1/3 of their open threes, we would be looking (at least) an NIT berth and Frank's job would be safe. And the shooting woes would be at least partially attributable to covid.

But if Frank is gone, the picture that is shown every time we play Ole Miss is emblematic. It notes that Devotae Shuler - who singlehandedy beat us in both games this year - was the star of an AAU team that also included Ja Morant and Zion Williamson. The South Carolina Hornets are actually based in Columbia - Irmo, actually - and none of the three wound up here. I get that Zion had Clemmons influences and was considered too big of a prospect to stay in-state - which is, in itself, an indictment of the program.

But losing Shuler - who went to the same HS as BJ McKie before heading to prep school - and Ja Morant, who went to a smaller school because South Carolina did not pursue him until late - is a sign that something is wrong.

Even this year, we only got the #5 in-state player - who is also only the 3rd best player on his own HS team, per 247 Sports. For whatever reason, Frank was never able to convince the top in-state kids to stay home after Sin and PJ.

If you cannot do a better job of recruiting your own state, you are not going to be able to win at a high level.

Had USC gotten shuler, morant, gary, bruner, james and nesmith, USC would have been in the hunt for an SEC title.   But Frank couldn't get any of those guys, and here we are, about to hire a new coach.

I think the university has done a good job of reaching out to the minority community - but could do better. But minorities - and by minorities, I mean Blacks when it comes to basketball - still feel that there are issues with the way they are treated in the Columbia area, and the state as a whole.

Frank is a minority himself and his wife is Black, but I do not think that Blacks in South Carolina relate to a Cuban from Miami and consider his one of their own. For that, we would need to bring in a Black coach with ties to the university and area, and then promote winning with state players - kinda like we started to do with Sin and PJ. 

I had touted Alex English as Head Coach - local, alumni, great NBA career, success in the G League - but I think that age and lack of college coaching would rule him out as anything more than a short-term fix. Boynton would help, but he is "from off" and I doubt that he wants to leave his current gig.

Maybe look at Black head coaches, and hire a Black assistant with local ties - I know the Doziers, Zam Frederick and others have had success at the HS level and would be good hires.

If you have to hire a black coach in order to succeed, just shut the program down.   I don't want to play those kind of games, or recruit those kind of players.  

 

[Gary]

Gary - I am watching Alabama play now - Juwan Gary (any relation, LOL?)  from Columbia just got a putback. Also on their team is Jordan Bruner from Columbia.

Neither is a star, but both contribute on the best team in the SEC. They have two players from USC's hometown, we have none.

But your stance on a Black coach is silly and childish I doubt if you said a word whenever we hired  a white coach in the past. Hiring a qualified Black coach with local ties as a Head Coach or assistant is not a game, it is a simple and logical move that would help recruiting.

Someone told me that we hired a Black woman to coach the Lady Gs - should we shut that program down too?

Alabama, Auburn, Ole Miss, Miss. St., LSU, Arkansas, Tennessee, Florida and UK don't have black head coaches and they have successful programs.  There is no reason USC has to have a black coach in order to be successful.  That was my only point.  If other schools in the south can be  successful with head coaches who aren't black, USC should not be the exception.  

 

[gamecock88]

Frank accepting another position within the AD will probably have an effect on who we can go after and expect to land from a financial standpoint.   Whomever, we need to be able to recruit the state and the region.  Plenty of talent to build a program with if we can improve image and relationships that have influence.   If not, expect more of the same.  

 

[Gary]

Just read Phil's write-up.

We are 12th is FG pecentage, 12th in Three Point percentage, and 13th in FT perecentage.

But what is amazing is that we are 14th - last - in both FG percentage and Three Point percentage DEFENSE.

Phl says we are going after Boynton - but I do not see him leaving, as Okie State made a bold move giving Boynton a chance, and he has a good connection with his players. If anything, it would be a backwards career move - leaving a more successful program for a struggling one.

And I do not see us out-bidding them - while we are having to pay Frank 6 Million on top of the Muschamp buy-out.

Boynton's team at OKST. is mostly freshmen and sophomores.   They will lose that kid to the NBA, but they have a good group that should return.   The situation will be a lot different at USC.   It depends on whether coaching at USC is really important to Boynton.   If it is his dream, he might accept the job, if offered.  If he stays where he is, he likely won't ever get the chance to coach USC again.

 

[Blitzkrieg]

Boynton's team at OKST. is mostly freshmen and sophomores.   They will lose that kid to the NBA, but they have a good group that should return.   The situation will be a lot different at USC.   It depends on whether coaching at USC is really important to Boynton.   If it is his dream, he might accept the job, if offered.  If he stays where he is, he likely won't ever get the chance to coach USC again.

I also think Boynton would be an excellent choice. A USC grad, a minority in a sport dominated by minorities with ties to NYC/NY. Not to mention he has D1 coaching experience and has his current team ranked in the top 20.

 

[LBC]

Just read Phil's write-up.

We are 12th is FG pecentage, 12th in Three Point percentage, and 13th in FT perecentage.

But what is amazing is that we are 14th - last - in both FG percentage and Three Point percentage DEFENSE.

Phl says we are going after Boynton - but I do not see him leaving, as Okie State made a bold move giving Boynton a chance, and he has a good connection with his players. If anything, it would be a backwards career move - leaving a more successful program for a struggling one.

And I do not see us out-bidding them - while we are having to pay Frank 6 Million on top of the Muschamp buy-out.

I know I have been banging this drum for some time now but we quite simply do NOT play the game of basketball very well. It is all about coaching. There are PLENTY of teams with far less talent than USC who play the game far better, try just as hard and whose coach doesn't blame his team for how they are playing the game it is his job to coach. There is a reason we play with so little confidence and why even at the very end of the season long time players are still being left at home or benched to prove some point other than a better player is in front of them on the depth chart...for the 100th time.

 

[Spur's Addiction]

I'm still not sure what happened after the Final 4 run. That should have been a spring board for recruiting and more sustained success. But instead everything just fell apart. 

 

[Gary]

Fun fact - out of all the programs that you list, only one - Florida - has NEVER had a Black Head Coach in Basketball. In fact, Florida and South Carolina are the only two SEC teams that have never had a Black Head Coach in basketball.

You are looking at the schools that make up the Deep South (Florida is not really in that category, they did not join become a state until 1845 and were never a big slave-owning state) that all have had a Black coach. Except one -South Carolina. We also have never had a Black Head Coach in football - even places like Mississippi State and Kentucky have had Black Head Coaches in football.

So you have identified a problem - the perception among the local Black community in general and AAU coaches in particular - and are saying that never looking seriously at hiring a Black Head Coach in Basketball (or Football) has nothing to do with the problem? And it disgusts you that it would be considered? 

Houston, I think (we know why) we have a problem.

Is the perception among the SC black community accurate?   I don't believe it is.  It makes no sense that they would consider USC to be anti black when the three current assistants to Martin are all black, Dawn Staley is black, most of the football assistants are black.  Most of the players on the USC basketball, football and women's basketball teams are black.  

Now, what makes more sense is that local blacks want EVERYTHING at USC to be totally black.  That I can believe.

As for AAU coaches, their favorite color is green.  And they have not seen enough of it from USC.

 

[GregoryHouse]

Is the perception among the SC black community accurate?   I don't believe it is.  It makes no sense that they would consider USC to be anti black when the three current assistants to Martin are all black, Dawn Staley is black, most of the football assistants are black.  Most of the players on the USC basketball, football and women's basketball teams are black.  

Now, what makes more sense is that local blacks want EVERYTHING at USC to be totally black.  That I can believe.

As for AAU coaches, their favorite color is green.  And they have not seen enough of it from USC.

I don’t know if it is that. Most programs in South Carolina and around the country don’t have black head basketball coaches but they can get some attention from their in state prospects...our local players can’t wait to get away from Columbia and from South Carolina (it seems)

i guess if you can play well enough to play for UNC, Duke, Kentucky or another top program in the south their is no reason to stay home but that final four run should have been a testimony (as well as the women’s team success) that players can stay local and make big noise.

 

[Gary]

I don’t know if it is that. Most programs in South Carolina and around the country don’t have black head basketball coaches but they can get some attention from their in state prospects...our local players can’t wait to get away from Columbia (it seems)

Clemson also didn't get any of those players who went out of state.